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Should I get into Naomi ?

pixelvsprintdot

pixelvsprintdot

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Hi everyone, I don’t know much about pricing for the original Naomi but I would like to be able to have a MVC2 and CVS2 set up in my Astro city.

Someone I know is willing to sell me a set up compatible with my cab. It would include the flowing:

Naomi 1 mother board
capcom JVS adaptor
Dimmboard/cd thing
All cables needed
MVC2 cart
CVS2 cd and key
Naomi power supply

For 1k would I be paying a fair price ?


Thank you in advance
 
Plus+1 on the netdimm recommendation. Saves you from having to swap the carts too given the amount of problems that can be caused by it. I've got a pair of classic carts that came with my setup but intend to switch 100% over to a netdimm setup once I get everything up and running.
 
If you get into Naomi, I suggest trying to finding a mobo locally to avoid damaging in shipping. Or if you buy online and get it shipped, make sure the seller is securing the GPU inside. I've had folks stuff antistatic bubblewrap where the cart/dimm slot is to secure the GPU from getting rattled around.

Naomi's are getting hardware finnicky now. Especially Naomi 2's. The GPUs have ball grid array soldering (BGA), and are prone to cracking these days. A small jolt can dislodge it and will require to get "re-balled", which is an expensive service that isn't so widely available. Even Ken at irepairsega.com , who is considered the top shelf sega repairer, will give very specific instructions on packing up naomi's to send to him for repair. In some cases, when those instructions aren't followed, he would just return the package, unrepaired.
This is due to how the Naomi was designed. The case gives no support for the BGA to stay secured. And with the age of these BGA's and solder getting older, cracking is highly likely.

So if you can find it locally to avoid shipping, I recommend that. Otherwise make sure the person who sends you one properly secures it in the package.
 
Tyrith said:
Plus+1 on the netdimm recommendation. Saves you from having to swap the carts too given the amount of problems that can be caused by it. I've got a pair of classic carts that came with my setup but intend to switch 100% over to a netdimm setup once I get everything up and running.
Click to expand...
What problems can it cause and how do we prevent them from happening
 
shelcoof said:
What problems can it cause and how do we prevent them from happening
Click to expand...
If the BGA solder is cracked? The Naomi will not function. Period. You'll get a black screen, no boot, etc...

Prevention is tough. There's not much you can do. Arcade hardware is a ticking time bomb. Eventually, things fail.

I just suggest:
- When storing the Naomi, do it horizontally so that gravity isn't pulling on the BGA's. Not vertically like other solid state boards.
- When running it, make sure all your voltages are correct (5v, 3.3v being the most important).
- No jolts, jostles, don't drop the thing! Hard concussive impacts will for sure mess it up.
- Make sure the case and mobo fans are working and keeping the unit cool.

carboncycle1313 said:
I am thinking about selling my Naomi 2 how would I find the instructions on how to secure the GPU?
Click to expand...
You need instructions to stuff anti-static material into the case? Just put antistatic bubble wrap, foam or packing material inside the case around the BGA's. The Naomi 2 has 2x BGA's. They are the two big metal squares with the heatsinks on them. Can't miss it.
Having 2 BGAs is why the Naomi 2 even more prone to damage since the Naomi 1 has only one BGA. You could even go so far as to removing the PCB from the case and wrapping it up separately. I've done that a couple times before when sending Naomi's. Extreme? Maybe, but I made damn sure those BGAs were secured.
 
BGA solder cracks were an issue when we switched to lead free solder. Sony PS2, XBOX 360, are consoles that used lead free solder in their construction. But Microsoft XBOX, Sega Dreamcast use leaded solder (and I believe Naomi as well) so solder ball cracks shouldn't be a thing. Is Naomi solder ball cracks a thing that some repair techs have been fixing?
 
opt2not said:
If the BGA solder is cracked? The Naomi will not function. Period. You'll get a black screen, no boot, etc...

Prevention is tough. There's not much you can do. Arcade hardware is a ticking time bomb. Eventually, things fail.

I just suggest:
- When storing the Naomi, do it horizontally so that gravity isn't pulling on the BGA's. Not vertically like other solid state boards.
- When running it, make sure all your voltages are correct (5v, 3.3v being the most important).
- No jolts, jostles, don't drop the thing! Hard concussive impacts will for sure mess it up.
- Make sure the case and mobo fans are working and keeping the unit cool.


You need instructions to stuff anti-static material into the case? Just put antistatic bubble wrap, foam or packing material inside the case around the BGA's. The Naomi 2 has 2x BGA's. They are the two big metal squares with the heatsinks on them. Can't miss it.
Having 2 BGAs is why the Naomi 2 even more prone to damage since the Naomi 1 has only one BGA. You could even go so far as to removing the PCB from the case and wrapping it up separately. I've done that a couple times before when sending Naomi's. Extreme? Maybe, but I made damn sure those BGAs were secured.
Click to expand...
Really appreciate the advice and info
I never knew they were prone to breaking like that

I recall a few months back I ordered a NAOMI for a pretty good price off ebay

When I booted it up I just got a black screen
Looked mint in excellent shape with no signs of damage at all
Seller packed it well too

I had to send it back sadly
This could be the reason why it came DOA
 
leonk said:
BGA solder cracks were an issue when we switched to lead free solder. Sony PS2, XBOX 360, are consoles that used lead free solder in their construction. But Microsoft XBOX, Sega Dreamcast use leaded solder (and I believe Naomi as well) so solder ball cracks shouldn't be a thing. Is Naomi solder ball cracks a thing that some repair techs have been fixing?
Click to expand...
Reballing BGA's was one of the main things Ken was doing with repairing Naomi's for the last decade. Aside from the regular fixes like bad buffers and supercap replacements.
I heard that he doesn't even offer the reballing service anymore because of the time consumption and unreliability. I myself had a Naomi 2 he previously worked on with @SnakeGrunger go bad again. Ended up calling that one a loss and buying a working Naomi 1 to replace it.

(For those new, or who might not know, Ken at https://irepairsega.com/ is a former Sega tech who worked on this hardware out of the Chicago branch for many many years. After leaving Sega, he has been doing hardware repairs as a side hustle out of his garage. He has vast knowledge of a lot of hardware, from Sega and others. Located in California now, he's been a reliable contact and service to the arcade community)
 
Naomi2's notorious for failing unfortunately. Ken used to reball BGAs, but said he quit doing it because it was so time consuming. Sega's board designs meant you had to redo all 3 BGA chips for every service, as the chips were too close to each other when heating up the board.

Biggest culprit is Hikaru boards. Sorry that had to happen @opt2not !
 
The failure information is great. TIL.

To the original question, Naomi has an amazing library spanning many genres. Excellent fighting games, shmups, sports games, and even gun and racing games if you have the right equipment (hint: OpenJVS + USB). If you're going to get a JVS setup, it's the first platform I would recommend. Only a handful of titles are exclusive to Naomi 2, so a Naomi 1 will cover almost everything you'd want to play (unless you're a Virtua Fighter fan).
 
This failure info terrifies me. I have a working Naomi 2 that I got shipped from Dubai last year, then had HDMI-modded, recapped, and silent fan-modded. I also took it with me on a move. Overall I'm like $1k deep into it. I've had no issues at all so far, fingers crossed.
 
RynoW said:
This failure info terrifies me. I have a working Naomi 2 that I got shipped from Dubai last year, then had HDMI-modded, recapped, and silent fan-modded. I also took it with me on a move. Overall I'm like $1k deep into it. I've had no issues at all so far, fingers crossed.
Click to expand...
Don't drop the unit ! That kind of impact can break the BGA soldering.
 
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