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Possible to Convert Raiden II to DX?

a few weeks ago I got my hands on a legit Raiden DX PCB so I decided to look a little deeper into this conversion since I could have both boards side by side.

looking at A18 on the program ROMs it runs to an 18cV8PC-25 chip directly above the ROMs. this is a PAL (data sheet here: https://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/view/81926/ETC/18CV8.html)

Seibu assigned this number "JJ5004" and this PAL does not exist on the original Raiden II PCB, so it seems that is how the extra address line is handled.

below the program ROMs are 2 other PALs that Seibu has labeled differently between the two boards as well...

Raiden 2 -> Raiden DX
JJ4B01 -> JJ5001
JJ4B02 -> JJ5002
nothing-> JJ5004

None of these appear to be dumped or reversed. I suppose depending on how the additional PALs are hooked up and if they ever get dumped or reversed you could potentially make a sub-PCB that plugs into the ROM sockets but on a whole this seems like more work than it's worth given the price difference between the two games.
 
Hy

thanks for looking into this.

too bad that ist not worth the efford.



ps: do you perhaps know if it is possible to easily ad the flip funtion to pcb that do not have it.

want to flip my namco Collection 2
 
ReplicaX said:
I have a legit minty Raiden DX if you need specific pics lmk.

You'd hate the fact I picked it up for $50 back in the day.
Click to expand...
During "the days" those were normal prices... I can't say that they were cheap though, times and income was very different back then. I bought my Raiden 2 and DX boards for similar price too. Many other boards were cheap too, and quite many deemed very rare and expensive today were common finds (tells something about how LOT of PCBs are just collected...).

Another of these had faulty sound (sharp distorting noise) - after a while of playing PCB heated a bit and the sounds went bad. With cold spray I was able to isolate the problem inside the epoxy "chip" and another end of it. As it was a day long before the repro for this epoxy thingie existed I had no other choices than buying another PCB or try to fix it myself. Decided to try the latter one - after hour of sanding/grinding and scraping I had components and small pcb cleared from the area which had the problem. With some testing I found the component and took a replacement from old CGA card - voila, sounds were good again. I still have it, playing fine, never applied the epoxy...
 
Ghost bump. Helping a friend sell his PCBs and noticed this Raiden II PCB's silkscreen says "Raiden II DX".

My guess it was a DX and was for some reason "downgraded" to Raiden 2? EPROM labels look legit?

Anyone know if this can easily be converted back to DX? Or if there's a reason this is a Raiden II now?

IMG_2460.jpg


IMG_2459.jpg
 
There was two revisions of the Raiden DX board.

The first revision has a 1993 copyright on the PCB and uses three sound chips - a Yamaha and two Okis. The 1996 "New Version" PCB changed to a cheaper, single Oki sound chip, has shorter background music loops, and has autofire. However the 1996 New Version DX board also has Raiden II on the same board - if you power on with all four joystick directions triggered for either Player 1 or Player 2 along with Button 1 or Button 2 then it will swap over to the other game.

Your friend has the New Version Rev 2 board.

EDIT: I got this wrong. The pictured board is indeed a Rev 1 Raiden DX board running Raiden II ROMs.
 
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ShootTheCore said:
There was two revisions of the Raiden DX board.

The first revision has a 1993 copyright on the PCB and uses three sound chips - a Yamaha and two Okis. The 1996 "New Version" PCB changed to a cheaper, single Oki sound chip, has shorter background music loops, and has autofire. However the 1996 New Version DX board also has Raiden II on the same board - if you power on with all four joystick directions triggered for either Player 1 or Player 2 then it will swap over to the other game.

Your friend has the New Version Rev 2 board.
Click to expand...

DUDE....the picture of @djsheep 's board is right there, sitting with Yamaha and TWO OKI's.

He's got the 93 pcb.....and according to him, it's playing Raiden 2.


Hey Sheep! - I have Raiden 2 and DX boards...all the 93 versions.

At some point I can try the 2 roms in my DX board, and see what I can get, but this could also be an undumped version that was designed to account for the changed pal's, etc. that are on the DX board.

Security on all that was just broken in the past 2 years I believe, for MAME....so the pals may have finally been dumped as well.

I've never seen a 93' pcb that did what you are saying, so this is certainly new to me.
 
@djsheep - I will also tell you, that on my 93 DX pcbs, they chips at s1, s2, s7, and a3 are all straight to board and no sockets.
The chips at B5 and B3 are labeled seibu 5 and seibu 6 respectively, chip at s5 is labeled seibu 7.

The chips at S2 and S1 are both labeled DX Back-2 and DX Back-1 respectively.

It also looks like some of your object roms are socketed as well, specifically at h7.

Someone would have gone through a decent amount of work to convert this back down, if it wasn't done at factory.
 
bagheera369 said:
DUDE....the picture of @djsheep 's board is right there, sitting with Yamaha and TWO OKI's.
Click to expand...

The sound section of his pictured board isn't labeled Yamaha and is missing the Yamaha YM3014 DAC that would go underneath it.
Screenshot 2024-12-03 at 1.37.06 PM.png

It should look like this for a Rev 1 1993 board.
Screenshot 2024-12-03 at 1.38.28 PM.png

Also, the silkscreen label on the 1993 Rev 1 Raiden 2 board doesn't say "DX".
Screenshot 2024-12-03 at 1.38.36 PM.png

If we could get a clear picture of the CPU in the lower-right corner then we could say for certain. Rev 1 uses a NEC V30 CPU while Rev 2 uses a V33.
 
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I'm staring at my 93 rev 1 DX board, and it's also missing the YM3014, but has yamaha YM2151 and Has 1993 Raiden II DX Seibu on the silkscreen.

It does NOT switch over to Raiden 2...I've tried, just to make sure.
 
bagheera369 said:
I'm staring at my 93 rev 1 DX board, and it's also missing the YM3014, but has yamaha YM2151 and Has 1993 Raiden II DX Seibu on the silkscreen.

It does NOT switch over to Raiden 2...I've tried, just to make sure.
Click to expand...

@ShootTheCore For what it's worth, I also have a Rev1 Raiden 2 1993 pcb that does not and has not ever had the Y3014 populated either....but is populated at U1020 and 1023 where my other Raiden 2 93 pcb has the 3014 populated, but nothing at U1020 and U1023.
 
Okay, I just cross checked all the boards and @bagheera369 is right and I am wrong. The 1996 New Version board looks substantially different from either the 1993 Raiden II Rev 1 and 1994 Raiden DX Rev 1. So Sheep's friend must indeed have a DX board that's been converted to run regular Raiden II. Very interesting! It would be nice to get a dump of that board to see if the ROMs are any different than the Raiden II dumps already in MAME.

Here is the 1996 New Version Raiden II / DX PCB.

s-l1600.jpg
 
ShootTheCore said:
Okay, I just cross checked all the boards and @bagheera369 is right and I am wrong. The 1996 New Version board looks substantially different from either the 1993 Raiden II Rev 1 and 1994 Raiden DX Rev 1. So Sheep's friend must indeed have a DX board that's been converted to run regular Raiden II. Very interesting! It would be nice to get a dump of that board to see if the ROMs are any different than the Raiden II dumps already in MAME.

Here is the 1996 New Version Raiden II / DX PCB.

s-l1600.jpg
Click to expand...
Aint no thing...just striving for accuracy!!!

@djsheep - I too would like to see that board dumped, and if any differences exist, because NONE of the roms on my DX or 2 pcbs are labled "Seibu 8" anywhere at all.
 
Caught me as I was writing.

I wish you luck with it, and please post back here with any results you find!!!!
 
That looks like it could be a Korean board. ?
 
Interesting... So the thing that prevents Raiden Ii from being upgradable to DX is primarily the lack of address space on the program roms. But this looks like a proper dx board. I'd be interested to see those program roms dumped as there is twice as much ROM space as a normal raiden ii.
 
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